Newsmax Ch. 1115 will not record on TIVO

All - Newsmax (and some other channels) are delivered by Xfinity only via IP (Internet Protocol) technology. IP programming can be accessed the same way as non-IP programming on our X1 devices; the only difference is the delivery method and the way this network records.

IP delivered channels are not available on third party cable card devices due to technological limitations on those devices. 

There is no requirement to support CableCARDs for IP delivery, only for video services delivered over linear QAM.

Most new channel additions are expected to be delivered via IP.

We are facing the same challenge.  I spent over an hour yesterday and 4 hours today chasing after someone at Comcast that explain why they are doing this. 

The answer:  I was told that cablecards are dead!  Strange answer from my cablecard vendor.  They do not plan to permit Newsmax for TiVo via cablecard. 

I have 2 TiVo's with cable cards and one Comcast X1 box.  I can get Newsmax on the X1 box.  This verifies that the signal is coming through on the coax into my premise without trouble.  I don't want to use the X1 box.  I want to time shift on my TiVo, which I think is a wonderful device. 

HOWEVER,  Supervisor "Stephen" after hours on the phone, said the following.   COMCAST will not support Newsmax on their cablecards and has no plans to do so.  

He suggested I buy a Roku or a Firestick to stream Newsmax.  You might ask, why are they promoting non-TiVo vendors and filtering Newsmax.  Sounds like TiVo is a target? 

I pay for Comcast content and hardware.  Comcast has decided that Newsmax broadcast is reserved for their X1 boxes.  He said this is a policy decision.   He , said Comcast will be out of the cablecard business in two years.  

I time shift EVERTHING using TiVo.  I understand your requirements.  Mine are similar. 

Any solutions?   Is Fios any better?   

i think X1 is poorly designed.  Remote is designed like a brick with odd  angles. Some buttons light up and some don't.  It is poor human factors design.  The Supervisor said X1 has voice and TiVo doesn't.  He did not know that new TiVo's have voice support.  I had to explain to him the human factors in the peanut design. 

Hi,   I don't know about Fios. 

My first guess is that if the Tivo can't record Comcast/Xinity stuff might be the feud between the two companies. 

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-04-23/tivo-wins-ruling-in-comcast-royalty-fight-at-trade-agency

"TiVo Wins Ruling in Comcast Royalty Fight at Trade Agency"

Maybe it's more about the money than the technicals.  I don't know.

However, Newsmax is becomming more popular and who knows but maybe pretty soon it may begin to sink the Fox News ratings.  

Whatever the problem may be,  Comcast/Xinity should be supporting all of the viewers choices in programming and making sure that their equipment is compatible with other manufactures of DVR devices and not their own X1, X2 or whatever platform they are running on.

I too have 2 cable cards and 2 of the Comcast/Xfinity boxes and they should all be able to record to TIVO throught the cable cards.    One disturbing factor regarding CableCards is that the FCC did make a change in regulations.

"FCC drops rule requiring cable companies to provide CableCARDs"

https://thedesk.matthewkeys.net/2020/09/fcc-cablecard-sunset-comcast-tivo-silicon-dust/

Read the 2nd to the last paragraph below:

"The Federal Communications Commission on Friday quietly dropped a rule that required cable television companies to provide specific digital decryption hardware when requested by customers.

For years, cable companies have been required to provide that hardware, known as a CableCard to video subscribers as an alternative to cable company-issued set-top boxes, which often came with antiquated software and rental fees.

The requirement was imposed by the FCC in the late 1990s on the assumption that CableCARDs would lead to a thriving marketplace of third party cable boxes that generated competition for rented set-top boxes offered by cable companies.

That competition never materialized, FCC commissioners conceded on Friday, making the rule unnecessary.

One reason CableCARDs didn’t take off is because few products came to market that supported it. In the 1990s, FCC commissioners assumed television set manufacturers would readily integrate CableCARD slots into their high definition-capable models.

Though some TV set manufacturers did support CableCARD, it was often in expensive high-end models. By the mid-2000s, only around 141,000 CableCARDs were in use by cable TV subscribers in the United States, according to data reported by cable companies and collected by the FCC.

To increase CableCARD adoption, the FCC created a new mandate that required all set-top boxes offered by cable companies use CableCARD technology after 2007. President Barack Obama revoked that requirement when he signed the Satellite Television Extension and Localism Act Reauthorization (STELAR) in 2014.

Since then, cable companies have been able to introduce their own set-top boxes that allow video subscribers to access live and on-demand programming through other means, the FCC noted on Friday.  Consumers have also shifted away from traditional cable TV service in recent years, opting for on-demand and linear streaming services like Neflix, Hulu, Amazon, YouTube TV and Sling TV, the FCC said.

“Consumer demand for retail CableCARD devices never developed as anticipated and such demand has declined steadily in recent years due to the growing popularity of [streaming services],” FCC commissioners said.

The FCC commissioners said cable companies are still required to “provide separable security,” but they said that condition could be met by providing streaming applications that allow cable customers to access programming on streaming devices like Roku, Amazon Fire TV, Apple TV or Android TV devices. Most cable companies have offered these apps for years without government regulation or intervention, the FCC noted, and as long as they continue to do so, they’ll meet the separate security requirement.

For at least a little while longer, CableCARD technology is expected to remain in use by the larger cable companies, though over time companies are likely to shift consumers toward their own set-top boxes and streaming apps.

When the day comes for cable companies to sunset CableCARD support, the move could be a blow to San Francisco-based TiVo, one of the few companies that continues to manufacture and sell traditional set-top digital video recorder (DVR) boxes. TiVo’s $400 DVR, known as the Tivo Edge,  only supports digital cable and requires customers to use a cable company-provided CableCARD (a cheaper version of the Edge requires an antenna and isn’t compatible with digital cable service).

The move could also create complications for Silicon Dust, a manufacturer of network streaming TV boxes. The tech company is currently developing a variant of its HDHomeRun device that is compatible with digital cable and allows users to stream or record six channels at once — but only if they have access to a CableCARD."

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Now maybe the focus should be on TIVO to somehow be able to record whatever WE receive as their customers of Comcast/Xfinity ?

Best of luck.

Thanks.   

I talked to tech at Comcast.  He said the technical issue is that Newmax broadcasts "IP Stream" protocal.    I got the impression that Comcast decided not to invest in a cable card that will handle it.   

I would like a workaround to record Newsmax other then using an X1 box.  

re:

"IP delivered channels are not available on third party cable card devices due to technological limitations on those devices.   There is no requirement to support CableCARDs for IP delivery,"

What would the cost be for Comcast to simply purchase NEW CableCARDS that handle IP delivery ?

How many people are being affected by having CableCARDS to power their TVs ?    We NEED upgraded CableCards to  pick and RECORD those IP channels.     You suggst also that there will be MORE IP cahnnels coming.       I think that with the profits that COMCAST makes they certainly can help out their customers.   I've been with you guys since 1985.

Here Comcast has spend bundles of money and upgraded all sorts of other Comcast equipment.  Surely Comcast can afford to purchase the NEWER CableCards to support IP technology even if they are owned by a 3rd party.     Also CableCards do not appeart to be a "big ticket" item as far as expense goes to purchase them.  If  they should somehow be "expensive" to purchase they why wouldn't Comcast develop them and brand them as Comcast equipment ?

Finally if Comcast is too cheap to buy these CableCards, then why can't comsumers like me purchase them from some company ?   Surely Comcast must know the company selling this product.   Maybe Comcast can direct folks like me to thiis  company that sells these upgraded CableCards and we can purchase them on our own.  Sounds like Comcast is just being cheap on this issue.

@jpgredwine Cablecard devices (and cablecards)  that support IP delivery don't currently exist.  No one makes them. We don't have plans to make them or support them. 

Ok, that makes sense now.  Thank you for the reply.